small room,big drivers...

[smithie]

hi guys
can i say a big hello to one and all....hello
my recent quest for my dream system has just led me first to the hawthorne audio site and then on to this forum which i have been reading with a vengence,soaking as much up as i can,can i say im well impressed with the builds,projects,the input and general friendlyness of this site and love the active input and willingness of the creators to listern/share/try and think outside the box..get it?,. you see what i did there?
i realise the answers i seek are proberly imbedded in the various threads on this forum and ive found afew but im hoping someone can answer my questions here so i have a central point to view what i need to know
ok the main issue is i have a very small room,its 13ft by 11ft and the system is set up to play across the shortest length of the room (11ft).
the speakers are 8ft apart,1 speaker being in a corner postion,the other in free space.
basically i have a 2ft by 2ft space allowed for each speaker.
so my main question is can i get a half decent sound from the Silver Iris OB 15" Coaxial Units with the restriction/space i mention above + at some point i may add the other 15" bass units,remembering the speaker have only 2ft sq to sit in so basically 1 is going to be in a corner postion and the other is still going to be very close to the back wall.
i realise the first thing some will say is go for the 10 inch version,but im after the scale a 15" driver will bring to the party + as money is tight i may be able to get away with the pair of Silver Iris OB 15" Coaxial Units for awhile before i feel the urge to enhance the bass,as with the 10 inch i think its need straight away,feel free to correct me if im wrong here guys,its your guildance and knowledge i seek after all.
ill stop here for the moment,i have plenty more questions to ask but i dont want to turn this post into a book...to late i think
any help,advice would be much appricated.
all the best
smithie

[Darrel Hawthorne]

Hey Smithie,
Welcome to the forum and thanks for the intro.
Compared to some Silver Iris owners, your room is large.
Half decent sound? No, I 'am afraid not... You should get exceptionally good sound and settle for nothing less.

On the main web site I finally got around to posting a FAQ section that you may wish to check out. It has answers to many of these questions and some general thoughts on the differences between the drivers.

http://hawthorneaudio.com/faq.html

Check it out when you get a chance.
If you are a DIY we can help with baffle design and construction ideas. If you need speakers built for you we have field convertible models that allow one to start with just the coaxial and later add in the Augie if you find you want additional bass support.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,
Darrel

[smithie]

hi darrel
many thanks for your reply and telling me about the faq on your site,i missed that so i will certainly be checking that out later....theres just so much to read/take in.
on another note i sent you a message regarding postage cost via your shop site email contact address.
once again many thanks for the advice and welcome...im looking forward to getting involved and rest assured ill still have plenty more questions...im like that,im a cyberspace chatterbox
all the best
smithie

[hurdy_gurdyman]

Hey Smithie, welcome to the Forum! Being a chatterbox,, you'll be right at home here.

Dave

[ChoirAudio]

Yeah, Smithie welcome. We have heard everything Dave has to say, so a fresh breath of air would be welcome.

[hurdy_gurdyman]

Yeah, Smithie welcome. We have heard everything Dave has to say, so a fresh breath of air would be welcome.

Dave

[smithie]

hehe
hi guys thanks for the warm welcome.
i must point out that im a chatterbox but didnt say i have anything usesful or wise to say
ok let me fire another question in here...
these speakers could be the answer to my dreams regarding my audio playback,but i need to ask this question, and that question is always a iffy thing to ask on a forum thats dedicated to said product but from my short scan thro the forum so far it seems alot more open,unbiased then some of the others ive joined so im hoping ill get a fair/clear unbiased answer...ok thats enough build up heres the question...how do the i5" coaxial units sound???
by this i mean there tone,detail,presentation etc? i ask this as ive mainly grown up with the sound of metal drivers,mainly from ted jordan stable and do love there tone/presentation.
theres really no wrong or right in this game i feel,most stuff have some merits and we all have our own personal tastes regarding the sound and what we like /want from our sound/speakers,ive listerned to so much stuff over the years but ive always found myself coming back to teds drivers,moreso the full range units,but alas im into se valve amps as well and its not a ideal mix.
i guess im just alittle woried that these drivers are going to sound so alien to me and that i might not find enough of the traits i seek from a driver,when you cant hear them these things must run through most peoples minds,its not a personnal dig/attack at the drivers so please dont think that,its about getting a handle on it and finding out if its right for me without hearing them
all the best
smithie

[willyspuddle]

What do they sound like?

Open spacious sound typical of Magnepan/Acoustat/Quad.
Dynamics and efficiency typical of Klipsch Heresy/Cornwall (3 watts is plenty).
Imaging typical of concentric designs like Altec/Tannoy/Jensen.

They really are a marriage of several successful , proven designs.

It cannot be guaranteed you will love the drivers. If you take the leap of faith and do not like them, you WILL be able to get back 75%+ of your monies selling used.

Cheers!

[hurdy_gurdyman]

What do they sound like?

Open spacious sound typical of Magnepan/Acoustat/Quad.
Dynamics and efficiency typical of Klipsch Heresy/Cornwall (3 watts is plenty).
Imaging typical of concentric designs like Altec/Tannoy/Jensen.

They really are a marriage of several successful , proven designs.

It cannot be guaranteed you will love the drivers. If you take the leap of faith and do not like them, you WILL be able to get back 75%+ of your monies selling used.

Cheers!

I agree with this completely.

I've never had the chance to hear Jordan metal drivers. I have heard good things about them in general. I have heard several smallish Fostex fullrange drivers and can comment a bit on the differences there. What one gets from the PSI 15 Coaxial drivers that no small fullrange driver can do is the sense of dynamic slam one hears from live music. Also, the lack of any kind of strain even when played loud. You have to get into insane loud before you can hear strain, which is from the inexpensive tweeter finally crying uncle. That's where the higher cost of the Sterling can easily justify itself (among other things).

The 15 inch drivers have nothing to do much above 2.5 kHz, so they aren't working particularly hard. The compression tweeters are very efficient and are padded down, so they normally aren't working hard, either. This translates into a sense of ease that small fullrange drivers can only get at modest levels. The SI mid-bass driver goes down into the 40's something Hz range and will play loudly with very little cone movement. Clean! On a modest sized baffle, one should expect bass to be flat to between 50 something and 80 Hz, so a much lower XO can be used than with a tiny driver, unless it's horn loaded, which has it's own issues. Hearing this full, clean and natural upper bass through lower mid-range for the first time is an eye opener showing you what you've been missing in most systems.

There is no such beast as the perfect speaker. They are all compromised. You need to look at what type of sound you like and choose your drivers according to what they do that you want, and that you can tolerate the areas they aren't so good at. Personally, I find few flaws with the SI PSI 15's (and the SSI's just get better yet). They image great and have clean, dynamic sound that is a lot like music. Distortion and listener fatigue is very low. If you have a large recording collection, you'll probably find a lot more recordings that are easy to listen to than before.

Also, remember to give it a while to break in. Right out of the box can be a bit harsh.

Dave

[ALF]

G'day Smithie and welcome to our family
The other fellas have said it pretty well, and as I believe that "useful and wise" is much over-rated, I won't add much more - except to say ...
The first time I heard the SI concentrics I immediately thought of Tannoy Gold 15" ... the imaging is remarkable - the sound honest, clean and dynamic (and the price extraordinary).
Your room size isn't too bad, and while a corner position ain't the most desirable option in a purist's mind the bit of bass boost might work to your advantage .... I used to have a pair of OBs (not SIs) that I made specifically for corner positioning and they sounded OK.
I'd choose the 15"s.
Have fun

ALF

[smithie]

hi guys
thanks very much for your insight and views,its much appricated.
at the end of the day im ready for a change as my system doesnt do it for me of late,ive been in this game for 30 years so its not a wimm thing,theres aspects to my system i really love,but at the end of the day if it doesnt have scale,dynamics and punch amongst other things then its always gonna sound like hifi,a mini version of a event and thats not what im after,its been said that its the first watt that counts and im a believer in that,i can see a change in amps going hand in hand with this upgrade...oh well i can live with that
this is a great forum and the founders and people that make the company/ product are spot on to and that on its own is worth the price,this stuff is few and far between these days although ive been lucky to meet afew over the years .
ok some more reading up to be done and a bit of selling to get some funds up then ill shall bite the bullit.
once again many thanks for all the insight,views and thoughts,its been a great help and rest assured ill be popping my mind numbing questions on here with a vengence!
forgot to add,over the thirty years experience ive gained ive found the best upgrade/sound enhancer comes in liquid form...a nice read wine,a ice cold beer
all the best
smithie

[ALF]

forgot to add,over the thirty years experience ive gained ive found the best upgrade/sound enhancer comes in liquid form...a nice read wine,a ice cold beer

A true audiophile!!! - I'm with you brother!

ALF

[Darrel Hawthorne]

hi guys
thanks very much for your insight and views,its much appricated.
at the end of the day im ready for a change as my system doesnt do it for me of late,ive been in this game for 30 years so its not a wimm thing,theres aspects to my system i really love,but at the end of the day if it doesnt have scale,dynamics and punch amongst other things then its always gonna sound like hifi,a mini version of a event and thats not what im after,its been said that its the first watt that counts and im a believer in that,i can see a change in amps going hand in hand with this upgrade...oh well i can live with that
this is a great forum and the founders and people that make the company/ product are spot on to and that on its own is worth the price,this stuff is few and far between these days although ive been lucky to meet afew over the years .
ok some more reading up to be done and a bit of selling to get some funds up then ill shall bite the bullit.
once again many thanks for all the insight,views and thoughts,its been a great help and rest assured ill be popping my mind numbing questions on here with a vengence!
forgot to add,over the thirty years experience ive gained ive found the best upgrade/sound enhancer comes in liquid form...a nice read wine,a ice cold beer
all the best
smithie

Hey Smithie,
Thanks for all your kind words, much appreciated!
Here are two links for you to check out:

Hall of fame pictures
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=3297

Long but should put a sizable dent in your questions about baffle considerations.
viewtopic.php?f=2&t=1195

I am of course available for any questions not covered or easy to find. Ask away.....


Cheers,
Darrel

[smithie]

hi darrel
many thanks for those links,i already hit those but your right they certainly answered some of my questions,and as for the pics,well that just makes me jealous as i know i dont have the talent to produce such works of art that are shown in those photos,a credit to you all guys,im more take the door off its hinges and jigsaw a hole to fit driver temepory solution kind of guy that never gets around to making a more finished result but maybe this time i will
just another quick question...what gains is there to be had to going to two augies per side?
all the best
smithie

[willyspuddle]

2 woofers placed near each other will play 3db louder with the same power as 1.
Plate amps that are inexpensive and provide xover duties usually develop full power in 4ohm loads.
2 Augies run mono make a nice 4ohm load.
4 Augies are ideal for a STEREO plate amp situation and still hit the magic 4ohm load.

Are 4 necessary? 2 seem to work fine for me, but I do drive them fairly hard The ability to achieve the same output at a lower gain setting is appealing. When you build a destination speaker(or have Darrel make it), what is another 300.00 for 4 Augies total?

Cheers!